Apple has handled its response, including its proposed App Store changes, to the EU's DMA with aplomb, despite the law being an assault on Apple's brand promise
an important perspective from someone who had to comply with EU's regs at Microsoft. … Romain Dillet / @romaindillet@mastodon.social : Apple appears to be very insecure with DMA-related App Store changes. It means that they know they're losing this fight and they're punching up. Alex Russell / @slightlyoff@toot.cafe : Whenever I re-read Apple's press release about DMA compliance and how users will be “confronted with a list of of default browsers before they have an opportunity to understand the options available to them”, I think back to the iOS onboarding flow and laugh and laugh and laugh and laugh. — [image] X: Albert Wenger / @albertwenger : The complexity of the EU bill made compliance with the letter but not the spirit possible. And Apple exploited that to protect its market power. We deserve better regulation of computation. John Gruber / @gruber : @TimSweeneyEpic @stevesi Tim Sweeney, socialist. @snazzylabs : @ostynhyss I've heard from numerous developers that they truly don't view themselves as anything other than altruistic; it's not malice as much as it is ignorance. Which is sad. I think they view visionOS as another gift to indie developers to hit it big again as happened with iOS. @ostynhyss : @SnazzyLabs Especially in a time where having developers is so critical to the success of Vision Pro. I can't believe they're even thinking about taking such a risk. But their recent actions show it to be so @snazzylabs : Burning developer goodwill is what hurt Microsoft 20-years-ago. Apple runs the risk of doing the same. They have to either make their platforms ever more compelling and worthy of the fees they charge, or open the gates and roll back fees. They cannot pursue growth at all costs... Tim Sweeney / @timsweeneyepic : @stevesi Your thesis is an ode to corporate power and is antithetical to the rights of users and developers worldwide. There is no cognizable legal or moral principle in support of Apple and others appointing themselves to lord over a new technological serfdom. Kontra / @counternotions : Priorities APPLE: https://1.apple/ 2.Users 3.Developers DEVELOPERS: 1.Developers 2.Users https://3.apple/ EU: https://1.eu/ 2.Spotify 3.Users Can you smell the Freedom Fries? Steven Sinofsky / @stevesi : I totally beat you on the word count :-) [link] John Gruber / @gruber : @stevesi The browser ballot thing is so ridiculous. But even worse, they should have learned from forcing it on Windows, that it's just a goddamn annoyance. Steven Sinofsky / @stevesi : @gruber They are very proud of it. Steven Sinofsky / @stevesi : Of note regarding this, the regulation in the EU Digital Markets Act applies to no European companies because the thresholds are (mysteriously) revenue of EUR 7.5 billion for three years, EUR 7.5 billion market cap, or 45 million MAU. John B. Roberts / @pencoyd : Excellent essay from @stevesi - long Saturday night read, but coming from someone with history and depth on the subject. https://hardcoresoftware.learningbyship ping.com/ ... Forums: Caius / Lobsters : Understanding Apple's Response to the DMA
The dispute matters because the DMA targets the rules governing distribution, payments, and customer relationships on a major mobile platform. This commentary frames Apple’s response as a conflict between regulatory interoperability requirements and the integrated experience Apple says underpins its platform promise.
First-order effects
Apple must operationalize EU-specific App Store changes while defending the security and product-design rationale for retaining substantial control over distribution and transactions.
Developers serving EU users must assess whether Apple’s new compliance terms create a viable alternative to the existing App Store path or simply add another set of costs and conditions.
Second-order effects
Criticism from large developers raises the likelihood that Apple’s terms, not merely the existence of alternatives, become the central enforcement question for EU regulators.
Alternative app stores, payment providers, and browser developers gain a formal route into iOS, but their ability to compete depends on the practical friction and economics of Apple’s implementation.
Third-order effects
The case points to platform regulation shifting from access mandates to detailed scrutiny of fees, default choices, and procedural controls—the mechanisms through which gatekeepers can retain leverage after opening an interface.
If enforcement treats nominal choice as insufficient, regulated platforms may need to compete more directly on service and pricing rather than rely on distribution rules; the eventual boundary remains dependent on regulatory interpretation.
The trend: The DMA is turning mobile-platform competition into a contest over whether compliance changes the economics and usability of access, not just the availability of new channels.
@stevesi The browser ballot thing is so ridiculous. But even worse, they should have learned from forcing it on Windows, that it's just a goddamn annoyance.
@stevesi
Steven Sinofsky on x
@gruber They are very proud of it.
@pencoyd
John B. Roberts on x
Excellent essay from @stevesi - long Saturday night read, but coming from someone with history and depth on the subject. https://hardcoresoftware.learningbyship ping.com/ ...
@stevesi
Steven Sinofsky on x
Of note regarding this, the regulation in the EU Digital Markets Act applies to no European companies because the thresholds are (mysteriously) revenue of EUR 7.5 billion for three years, EUR 7.5 billion market cap, or 45 million MAU.
@stevesi
Steven Sinofsky on x
Building Under Regulation // An in-depth essay on the EU Digital Markets Act focusing on Apple and compliance, supported by some history I experienced being regulated. Once reading there was a “browser ballot” I admit I was triggered into writing lots. https://hardcoresoftware.le…
@benedictevans
Benedict Evans on threads
The funny thing about Spotify's iPhone complaint is that it's almost the exception that proves the rule. It's very obvious that Apple's payment rules as applied to Spotify and e-books are anti-competitive and anti user, but hard to think of other examples. …
@parkert
Parker Thompson on threads
Spotify pays out more than 70% of gross revenue in royalties. They can't double payouts. Apple is happy to lose money on Music to stifle competition. When they say “pay artists more” it's not about artists, they DGAF, it's about trying to make independent music streaming busin…
@jimmylittle
Jimmy Little on threads
Apple should tell Spotify that if they agree to pay artists at the same rate as Apple Music, they'll waive the fees. Would Spotify rather double their artist payouts, or pay Apple? “We should be the only ones fleecing our content creators” is not a strong argument, Mr. Ek. …
@jimmylittle
Jimmy Little on threads
I think Benedict Evans generally has great insight, but he kinda missed this one. Spotify is no different than any other company. Spotify: 70% to creators (well, the creator's record labels) Google Play: 70% to creators App Store: 70% to creators Game consoles: 70% to creators …
@iainharper
Iain Harper on threads
Spotify can keep the Status Quo and continue to pay Apple nothing. What they want is to have their cake and eat it - to have their app within the iOS ecosystem refer a ton of subscription customers to them but pay nothing for those direct referrals. That's not how business work…
@chancehmiller
Chance Miller on threads
In a statement to me, Apple fires back at Spotify's ciritcisim of this weeks App Store news: “We're happy to support the success of all developers - including Spotify...The changes we're sharing in the European Union give developers choice...Every developer can choose to stay on …
@daveleebbg
Dave Lee on threads
Getting ugly real quick
@documentingmeta
@documentingmeta on threads
sure Apple this wouldn't be a problem at all if only you didn't have a competing product of your own called Apple Music
@frankreiff@mastodon.social
Frank Reiff on mastodon
This is as close to a “we are not amused” as the EU commission ever comes. — Google was fined 2.42B euros; Meta 1.2B.. — As an EU citizen I find it shocking that US companies simply believe themselves to be above the law.. and even more shocking that so many otherwise sane Am…
@eldsjal
Daniel Ek on x
After sitting with our legal team to parse through the fine print of Apple's DMA announcement (that took a while), which is, at best vague and misleading, I wanted to share my thoughts. While Apple has behaved badly for years, what they did yesterday represents a new low, even f…
@sriramk
Sriram Krishnan on x
It is often popular here to say “EU = bureaucratic regulations + decel”. In my experience with EU policy makers, it is more complicated and surprisingly often the reverse. below is a classic narrative violation. You have the EU pushing for what is undeniably “good” and a...
@elonmusk
Elon Musk on x
@eldsjal Very concerning
@kwekuoa
Kweku Opoku-Agyemang, Ph.D on x
It's definitely a strong approach, if not rather extreme. I'm not sure how sustainable it is, though. It's basically Epic's argument in broad daylight—but for developers—and on steroids. Hopefully cool heads will prevail.
@kwekuoa
Kweku Opoku-Agyemang, Ph.D on x
I'm actually not surprised. Epic was speaking to the switching costs argument: that Apple's walled garden locks users into iOS and may harm competition by not allowing consumers very easy access to alternative platforms if they're dissatisfied by high prices or locked out.
@elchefe
@elchefe on x
Bro you take half of the revenue from ads, pay your artists half as much as Apple and laid off a bunch of people for no reason, so you can, with every ounce of disrespect owed to a billionaire whining about unfair treatment, fuck all the way off into space.
@simmenfl
Florian Simmendinger on x
@eldsjal You don't have a right to do business on Apple's platform on your terms. You didn't build it. I also don't get to decide under which conditions I can publish my music on Spotify.
@joecarlsonshow
Joseph Carlson on x
@eldsjal Apple's 15% cut is too much, but you take a 50% cut from advertiser revenue on Spotify. [image]
@eldsjal
Daniel Ek on x
Sadly this is a classic move of an old, dominant company that believes the rules don't apply to them. Instead of adapting and innovating, they're twisting the situation, making it seem like the regulators are at fault. Or even worse, pretending this has to do with security when..…
@eldsjal
Daniel Ek on x
But of course, I was skeptical of Apple's intentions to comply after years of watching them get away with such extreme abuse with all the ways they skirt regulations around the world. Who wouldn't be? But the law is the law, right? Not if you are Apple...
@eldsjal
Daniel Ek on x
So where does that leave us? Under the new terms, we cannot afford these fees if we want to be a profitable company, so our only option is to stick with the status quo. The very thing we've been fighting against for five years.
@eldsjal
Daniel Ek on x
Their reaction to the DMA is a masterclass in distortion. They present a ‘simple’ choice: Stick with their current terms or switch to a convoluted new model that looks attractive on the surface but has potentially even higher fees. Reality check: Apple's alternative is no alter…
@mdudas
Mike Dudas on x
Apple are bad people. Their uncle created the recipe. They milk it, refuse to share and hold the best people hostage with"non-competes." It's like the Mafia serving the best pizza and Italian food in Little Italy. No one else can compete because they need to pay 30% to play...
@carnage4life
Dare Obasanjo on x
“A completely new 0.50 cent Euro fee per download, every year, in perpetuity, to Apple for just allowing developers to exist on iOS - This is extortion, plain and simple.” - Spotify press release https://newsroom.spotify.com/ ...
@patrickmoorhead
Patrick Moorhead on x
As discussed in the @TheSixFiveMedia Weekly podcast, @Apple is putting up smaller walls to circumvent the EC's DMA. Usually Apple is compliant, but it seems like the company is going to fight this tooth and nail. That 30% app and service payment for storing & security scanning...
@stevemoser
Steve Moser on x
Interesting but not surprising that Spotify is sticking with the status quo given the large fees they would incur for the free downloads of their app.
@film_girl
Christina Warren on x
The girls are fighting!!!!
@eldsjal
Daniel Ek on x
For almost five years - 1,782 days - we have been asking the European Commission to take action against Apple. You can imagine my excitement when the DMA was created and passed into law because it was such a progressive step against Apple's App Store monopoly.
r/Fauxmoi
r on reddit
Spotify accuses Apple of ‘extortion’ with new App Store tax: Spotify CEO Daniel Ek says Apple's new rules represent “a monopoly under a different mask.”
r/popculturechat
r on reddit
Spotify accuses Apple of ‘extortion’ with new App Store tax: Spotify CEO Daniel Ek says Apple's new rules represent “a monopoly under a different mask.”
@alexheath
Alex Heath on threads
With its response to the EU's DMA regulation, Apple has shown that it will continue being needlessly protectionist and punitive to the devs who help make its platform valuable. That bums me out! More on Apple's approach to sideloading on the iPhone in this week's newsletter, pl…
@theromit
Romit Mehta on threads
Outside a small % of very vocal, technically savvy consumers and of course large companies who don't want to give the App Store tax, who is it that feels iPhone has become better? I don't want it to be easy to add random app stores and side loading in an iPhone because ultimatel…
@benedictevans
Benedict Evans on threads
Who are these people who look at smartphone sandboxes and say that the PC security model works fine? What were they doing for the last 30 years?
@sixonedude
Mark Jacobs on threads
I don't know about “needlessly” given the security threats that had emerged on Android. I like being confident in the apps I download to my phone, and that other phones aren't going to be a problem for me. Apple's closed ecosystem has tradeoffs, but their market success suggest…
@romaindillet@mastodon.social
Romain Dillet on mastodon
Apple appears to be very insecure with DMA-related App Store changes. It means that they know they're losing this fight and they're punching up.
@gruber
John Gruber on x
@TimSweeneyEpic @stevesi Tim Sweeney, socialist.
@snazzylabs
@snazzylabs on x
@ostynhyss I've heard from numerous developers that they truly don't view themselves as anything other than altruistic; it's not malice as much as it is ignorance. Which is sad. I think they view visionOS as another gift to indie developers to hit it big again as happened with iO…
@ostynhyss
@ostynhyss on x
@SnazzyLabs Especially in a time where having developers is so critical to the success of Vision Pro. I can't believe they're even thinking about taking such a risk. But their recent actions show it to be so
@snazzylabs
@snazzylabs on x
Burning developer goodwill is what hurt Microsoft 20-years-ago. Apple runs the risk of doing the same. They have to either make their platforms ever more compelling and worthy of the fees they charge, or open the gates and roll back fees. They cannot pursue growth at all costs...
@timsweeneyepic
Tim Sweeney on x
@stevesi Your thesis is an ode to corporate power and is antithetical to the rights of users and developers worldwide. There is no cognizable legal or moral principle in support of Apple and others appointing themselves to lord over a new technological serfdom.
@counternotions
Kontra on x
Priorities APPLE: https://1.apple/ 2.Users 3.Developers DEVELOPERS: 1.Developers 2.Users https://3.apple/ EU: https://1.eu/ 2.Spotify 3.Users Can you smell the Freedom Fries?
@stevesi
Steven Sinofsky on x
I totally beat you on the word count :-) [link]
@dreamwieber
Gregory Wieber on threads
Apple's locked-down App Store has kept the iPhone one of the safest and easiest to use devices ever made
@gruber
John Gruber on threads
This is the short version: 5,000 words. A whole column's-worth of footnotes alone (873 words). Good thing I have a nice keyboard. https://daringfireball.net/...
@georgescriban
@georgescriban on threads
A lot of people on this (and other) web sites are: * working at companies that either compete with Apple or *think* they compete with Apple * super-fluent in technology and believe that everything that computes should a general purpose computer They're not normal people.
@Localcelebrity@mastodon.social
John Morrison on mastodon
Apple's bad-faith response to the EU's DMA legislation gives a preview of how ineffective American regulations will be like Post-Chevron Deference.
@gedeonm@mastodon.social
Ged Maheux on mastodon
Read this entire piece, wow, this had to be a pain to write, John. I don't understand a lot of how this will all play out but the final paragraph is indeed delicious irony. — Craig submitted iPulse for iOS to the App Store yesterday and we honestly have NO IDEA if it will pass…
@florian4gamers
Florian Mueller on x
The one thing that the EU may *really* get as a result of Apple's new DMA rules is native iPhone porn apps, requiring at least one iPhone porn app store. I'm not kidding you! This is real, though obviously not the victory for the EU and its citizens that @Andreas_Schwab and his..…
@carnage4life
Dare Obasanjo on x
Apple's response to the DMA by charging a €0.50 per install fee to “protect users” from 3rd party app stores is as self serving as its app tracking transparency changes for “privacy”. The key difference is that there isn't a convenient villain like Facebook for 3rd party stores
@maxrovensky
Max Rovensky on x
DMA is not pro-consumer It's anti big business Those tend to coincide sometimes, which makes it an easy sell for the general public, but do actually read the DMA, it's quite interesting
@gruber
John Gruber on x
Tried my best to keep this short and it still ran 5,000 words. Whole column-worth of footnotes alone.
@jeiting
Jacob Eiting on x
If Apple's stranglehold on app distribution is so terrible for everyone, what is preventing a new entrant from building a new phone with an open store and dominating the market?
@sdw
Sebastiaan de With on x
@derloos @MaxRovensky I love that I can't tell if you are talking about the EU or Apple in this case
r/apple
r on reddit
John Gruber: Apple's Plans for the DMA in the European Union